Categories: I found a bug! : Messaging : Android Mobile :

Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS

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Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS MrPapaWago 11/1/13 3:45 AM
Hi

I'm really glad to see SMS functionality added to the latest version of the Android App.  

However, a very significant problem is that the app doesn't seem to like sending SMS messages to multiple recipients, as soon as I add a 2nd recipient it gets converted to to a 'group MMS', even for short text only messages.  

Many people have free SMS in their plan, but certainly in the UK all providers charge for MMS.  This means for me to send an SMS to 5 people on any other app is free, to send the same message via SMS on hangouts will cost me £1.50.  

Please fix this Google!

Kind regards.






Please provide your OS, browser or mobile app version, and any other details that you consider relevant, so we can address your issue or question quickly.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS hayesdj 11/1/13 5:41 AM
I wholeheartedly concur that this is a must feature. 
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS dziegman 11/1/13 9:13 AM
Hi All!

Thanks for reporting!

I'm not sure if the released APK from sites is the latest version, but I'll check with the team to see if this is working properly.

Thanks! :)

Best,
dziegman
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Dori, Community Manager @ Google 11/1/13 11:21 AM
@MrPapaWago and @hayesdj,

What mobile device, version of Android OS, and version of the Hangouts app are you running?

Thanks,
Dori
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS MrPapaWago 11/1/13 11:25 AM
Hi Dori

I'm running Android 4.3 and v2.0.012 of Hangouts.

Regards.

Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS hayesdj 11/1/13 11:39 AM
Exactly the same here
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS hayesdj 11/1/13 11:40 AM
And im on an S4.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS dziegman 11/1/13 2:56 PM
Hi All!

I heard back from the team that this is working as intended.  Most other group texting apps work this way from my experience.  Perhaps there's a reason for it if they're all using it.  

Either way, they understand your concerns and have sent the feedback to the team.

Thanks!

Best,
dziegman
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS sidewinDr 11/2/13 6:03 AM
I just want to add support to the OP's suggestion. As it stands, the lack of this feature will ensure I won't be using Hangouts for my text messaging purposes. At least the default messenger for my HTC One gives me the option to choose whether to send group messages as SMS or MMS. Perhaps there's a reason why some apps are smart enough to implement it as a feature.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Kyle Newton 11/2/13 2:05 PM
the group messaging works great for 90% of people so please dont change that. With that said i think some people just want the option to choose whether its a group message mms or sms and sent out to every single person...which im surprised people still do
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS MrPapaWago 11/2/13 2:05 PM
I find 2 things surprising:

1) Most other group SMS apps work this way... in a house where 4 people have been using smartphones I haven't come across this before.  Personally, I've had nexus devices for a couple of years now now, and the stock messaging app didn't switch to MMS until you had more than 6 recipients
2) Someone at Google actually thought this was a good idea

This is definitely a deal breaker for me, I just did a quick scan of the group messages I sent last month and had I been using the Hangouts app I'd have added an extra £27 to my bill... over £300 a year to use Hangouts... no thanks!

Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS James Eastwood 11/4/13 4:03 AM
I have the same problem. All other SMS apps (specifically I have been using GOSMS) send SMSs to multiple recipients without any problem. It is completely new to me that I cannot send SMSs to more than 1 person.

I have a HTC one X, 4.3 running the latest hangouts.

I will have to switch back to GoSMS if I cannot do a simple thing like send a text to 2 people at once.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Richard Bellingham 11/4/13 5:05 AM
Yup, I switched to a different messaging app because of this - Sliding Messaging - which seems to be very good, flexible, customisable, with pop-up quick reply and other features I was missing in the new Hangouts app.It cost me £1.24 but that's cheaper than having Hangouts send MMS messages instead of SMS messages to groups. It's a bit disappointing that nobody during the development of the Hangouts app looked around the market at other SMS tools and realised that the group SMS option is always that... optional.

I also tried 8SMS, which is essentially the Cyanogenmod version of the stock messaging app, but KitKat didn't recognise it as a potential replacement SMS client even after I set it to Standalone mode.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS dziegman 11/4/13 8:45 AM
Hi All!

For the apps you're talking about that work this way, do they actually send SMS's or are they just messaging app?. Also, are they actually using the original person's number?  How do they forward to other people's phones (or rather how does it appear in the app).

I may be wrong, but if there's a license on the SMS only bulk messaging technology, then there may be a problem with Google getting that license.  Just putting it out there - that's why patents/proprietary technology makes it difficult and not straightforward to get features in an environment where you're not in total control.

Best,
dziegman
MrPapaWago 11/4/13 9:56 AM <This message has been deleted.>
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS MrPapaWago 11/4/13 10:10 AM
n my case I have only ever used the stock messaging app on any device that I’ve owned in earnest, they have all handled group SMS perfectly well.

Of the apps mentioned in this thread I believe that GO SMS is just a replacement for the stock messaging app and does actually send via SMS, I can’t speak for any of the others.

Whilst I quite like some of the other messaging services out there (particularly Hangouts with it’s web based functionality) many of my friends simply aren’t interested (some are, but that’s no good when you want to contact all of them) and since every phone (smart or feature) has SMS capability I find it far and away the most convenient way to contact them.

What bothers me most about this ridiculous implementation is that Hangouts is about to become the stock messaging app on my Nexus when I get the android 4.4 update and so I will have 4 choices:

1)     Use Hangouts to send group SMS and add about £27 per month to my bill – no thanks!
2)     Use Hangouts and send the same message separately to each recipient – no thanks!
3)     Change to a non-Nexus device – don’t really want to go there
4)     Install and use 3rd party SMS app like GO SMS – reluctantly, the only viable option for me

I can’t really see licensing being an issue, since Google must have had the appropriate license to handle Group SMS in the pre-KitKat stock Messaging app (on Nexus devices)

I can guarantee that many people won’t be expecting this behaviour, will have a surprise bill one month after getting their 4.4 update!

As Kyle Newton said, the best implementation wold be to give the end user a choice when sending group messages.
 
Cheers.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Matt Seabold 11/4/13 1:24 PM
It seems we are on somewhat of a disconnect here. For clarification:

There are two ways of sending messages to multiple people using the SMS/MMS protocols:

1. Send the same SMS message to each person on the list separately. In this manor, MMS charges are avoided, and only the original sender receives the replies of each intended recipient.
2. Send the message as a Group MMS. In this protocol, charges may occur, and each reply is sent to everyone on the original list, making it a true group chat message.

I understand the desire to have it either way depending on the situation, and most apps (including the AOSP messaging app from either 4.1 or 4.2 onwards) provides the ability to do this.

Note the image:


The "Group Messaging" checkbox allows the user to switch between these two methods. If this setting is not available in Hangouts, I can see where it would be a problem for a number of users.


Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Alex M UK 11/4/13 2:09 PM
I definitely agree, I've just received my Nexus 5 and I had to individually SMS people to avoid paying a ridiculous MMS charge. I'm glad I realised the MMS note before being charged a huge fee from my carrier!!!
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS daruda87 11/5/13 10:40 AM
same problem here, received the Nexus5 today, sent out a text message to a group of people and was amazed that i was an mms message instead of sms. Please fix this!
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Kyle Newton 11/5/13 10:47 AM
Just want to reiterate ..the hangouts group mms feature is working great for 95% of people. The only ones that are finding a problem are the people whos carriers charge for mms..(must be outside of U.S) . So if any of the developers are reading this please just add in the option for those people and dont change how hangouts is working now. 
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Matt Seabold 11/5/13 10:49 AM
Yes, what Kyle said. I didn't make that clear before. It is fine as is, there should just be a setting to disable it.

(And there may well be one already hidden as I actually do not have the updated app yet).
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS MrPapaWago 11/5/13 12:15 PM
Totally agree too (except with the 95% figure... must just be in the U.S.)  If we could just have the same choice that was in the stock messaging app, as described by Matt Seabold then everybody should be happy.  Perhaps some sort of visual prompt, pointing the user to the checkbox when using the app for the first time would be helpful too!
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Jon Stewart Photo 11/6/13 2:30 AM
I'm subscribing to this as well. What a nonsense. I'll be dumping hangouts altogether if this isn't fixed.

Thanks to the OP, and everybody else who chipped in. N5 Kitkat, Back to using Handcent.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS David Hancocks 11/6/13 10:06 AM
+1 OP

Can we have the old way back back please Google!

There's going to be some annoyed people out there when they get their bill end of this month and they've charged without realising it

Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Steve M House 11/6/13 10:09 AM
Yep this is a major issue having to move away from hangouts on my N5 because of this. We need the option to choose between SMS or MMS for groups messages.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS nblott5 11/6/13 12:12 PM
i am exactly the same. i want to use the stock apps on my nexus 5 but can't! 8sms is a good imitation of the old stock sms though. sort it out google
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Timothy Maroosis 11/6/13 12:12 PM
This is definitely important. For example, I have it off in the old messaging app because sometimes I have to send texts to my whole family about an event (party or whatever) and with mms on some people respond and it goes to all the recipients of the original message. Then everyone gets frustrated cause they are stuck in the text chain getting responses they don't care about and they may have texting limits on their plans. With MMS off I can send once to all but everyone's responses only come back to me. There is a need for both depending on the situation so it definitely needs to be an option.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS David Gawen 11/8/13 3:10 AM
" 95%... ...The only ones that are finding a problem... ....(must be outside of U.S) . "

I'm pretty confident that the rest of the world makes up more than 5% ;)

The App works 'as intended', it's just that this is isn't great.  "...just add in the option."  Agree completely, amazing they haven't done this.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Ion Marica 11/8/13 8:15 AM
dear kyle broflovski, you are speaking about people outside us as if us would be 95% of the entire world. that at lease results from your absurd calculations. almost all other countries charge for MMS. so please, google, make an option to select from sending MMS or standard SMS. even if group char is nice and neat, i really want to send individual sms to multiple recipients without them knowing i send it to 20 people. include BCC field :)
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS MrPapaWago 11/8/13 9:32 AM
Dori

Are you able to confirm if Google is planning to add the ability to send the same SMS to multiple recipients in the same way that it has always been available to non-US users via the stock messaging app?

I'm hoping this is resolved before my N4 get's it's 4.4 update which I understand will remove the stock app and replace it with Hangouts.

Cheers!
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Kyle Newton 11/8/13 9:39 AM
I wasnt being spot on with my 95% mark, sorry for that. What I meant I guess was most people love the feature of Group MMS. I know people in the U.S use it all the time and not many people use the single sms to group feature. I didnt realize that most other countries get charged for MMS which I just think is ridiculous. All it is is data..very small amount usually at that. I cant believe they can get away with that. I think the topic headline is a little misleading also, it says that there is something wrong with hangouts which is not the case. Google just needs to add in the simple option of having Group MMS and single sms to a group of people. For the people at google adding this feature would take very little time.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS mgmzungu 11/8/13 11:59 AM
Dziegman,
 
Having received my new Nexus 5 the other day, which I think is great by the way. I wouldn't normally find the group MMS an issue. However, I have found that should I wish to send a message to multiple friends, if one or more of them doesn't use the Hangouts app (i.e. iOS users), it comes up with a message advising I can invite them to use it, but I cannot send a message.
 
Whilst this maybe how its currently designed to work, its a major piece of functionality that is missing that needs to be added. I know there is added functionality in being able to send group messages, but I should be able to send single messages to multiple people without having to ask them to download the Hangouts app. They shouldn't have to add an app to receive certain messages from me.
 
Further to this, i'm going to search on the forums now, but I've found that if the Hangouts app is already loaded when the phone is locked. If you receive a message, when you unlock the phone it shows you the message because the app is already loaded, but the notification doesn't disappear. You have to clear it manually.
 
Thanks,
mgmzungu
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Plattfuss 11/8/13 1:07 PM
Just wanted to leave a post too. Using the phone in the UK & Germany, where SMS are included in most plans, MMS however not. Had to stop using hangouts and am using 8sms now. Needs to be changed google!
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Sammus187 11/9/13 1:08 PM
Adding my voice to this... Completely ridiculous not to be able to send sms to multiple friends at once. If I want to start a group chat thread I use an actual hangout or Facebook or something. I often want to send sms only to multiple people at once. I thought the sms integration in hangouts on my new n5 was cool, now I'm using 8sms.
Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS S. D. Mc 11/9/13 6:43 PM
I am going to have to disable SMS in hangouts and download a 3rd party SMS app because of this. I have friends on different phone OS (from simbian to BlackBerry) so hangouts for group messaging is a no go!   I'm not willing to pay MMS charges for group messages when all I wish to do is send the same SMS to a bunch of friends.  

The old Nexus 4 SMS app had an option in settings to avoid this I'm sure.

Can you please bring this back for the many millions of us who are charged for every single MMS sent (i suspect most of europe / non USA)

Cheers, Steve.

Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS blablup 11/10/13 1:10 AM
Same here. Replaced Hangouts by a 3rd party SMS app.
In Germany and probably the rest of Europe MMS are a rip-off! Nobody uses them!

This kind of ignorance is very annoying! Google should think things through properly from a customer point of view before releasing a product.

The Hangouts App has a few more issues anyway: Sorting and display of the address list is inconsistent with the Contacts App. Both should handle the address list in the same way.

Regards,
Hermann


Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS cdevjto 11/11/13 8:05 AM
I have a same problems as nearly everyone else here.

In the UK MMS charges are ridiculous, I have been happily using multiple SMS messages across a number of platforms for many years without a problem.  My most recent phone a Samsung Note II sends multiple SMS in the stock messaging app by default when using multiple recipients.

Right now it looks like Google didn't do a great job on this one so no SMS in hangouts for me, and as I pay the contracts for my 2 sons and my wife, I may be removing this feature their phones as well.

I hope that you are able to look at this as soon as possible.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS KennyWRX 11/11/13 8:21 AM
We need a switch in the settings to control whether messages going to multiple recipients will be kept as multiple SMS or grouped as one MMS.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS bghytrdfrgj 11/11/13 10:20 AM
I've just encountered the same mistake in the app. And it IS 100% a mistake. I'm not having this "it's a feature and it works as it should" nonsense. It's wrong. If it was a programming error it's an error. If they actually did want it to work like this then that decision is an error because no one in their right mind would make that choice. Sending SMS to a few people is not multimedia. It's a text sent to a few different people and no need to change it to MMS.

Fix it Google.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS WheatyBee 11/11/13 1:55 PM
Another new UK Nexus 5 user who luckily noticed this behaviour after one group send so only minimal damage done. My work colleague's Nexus 4 does have the option to disable MMS group sending in Hangouts. I think that this will garner very bad publicity for Google when reports of users with massive bills begin to hit the news.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Eskimono 11/12/13 2:38 AM
Also just seen this problem - you definitely need to be able to choose SMS if you don't want to send MMS to a group. Please Google can you fix this!
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Sean Gray 11/12/13 3:56 AM
Adding my +1 to this. I'm on a Nexus 5 - just noticed this behaviour today; unless this is changed, I can't use Hangouts for SMS so I'll be installing a 3rd party app.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Cadster 11/12/13 6:43 AM

On Friday, 1 November 2013 21:56:18 UTC, dziegman wrote:
Hi All!

I heard back from the team that this is working as intended.  Most other group texting apps work this way from my experience.  Perhaps there's a reason for it if they're all using it.  

Either way, they understand your concerns and have sent the feedback to the team.


I'm very surprised that the team think most group texting apps work this way, and like others here I would disagree. My Nexus 4 included the ability to turn OFF the 'Send to multiple recipients as MMS' option, so if 'the team' thought it worthwhile to include this option why have they suddenly disabled it under KitKat 4.4? Maybe put this exact question to 'the team'...!!
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Patrick Misch 11/12/13 9:22 AM
This definitely not a mistake. Yes, they should include a way to simply send to multiple people via SMS, but this is definitely the desired functionality that many people use (all iphone users, for instance). 
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Cadster 11/12/13 11:31 AM


On Tuesday, 12 November 2013 17:22:07 UTC, Patrick Misch wrote:
This definitely not a mistake. Yes, they should include a way to simply send to multiple people via SMS, but this is definitely the desired functionality that many people use (all iphone users, for instance). 

OK Patrick, could I just argue that Android is about increased functionality over iOS and should not be based on what people use... More about what people want. As I said, Android had this functionality and has removed it. To remove it is not the 'desired functionality' far from it.. the desired functionality is always to have the choice surely...? Even people that don't want this wouldn't argue that they don't want the option to change it...?
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Patrick Misch 11/12/13 11:39 AM
On Tuesday, November 12, 2013 2:31:29 PM UTC-5, Cadster wrote:

OK Patrick, could I just argue that Android is about increased functionality over iOS and should not be based on what people use... More about what people want. As I said, Android had this functionality and has removed it. To remove it is not the 'desired functionality' far from it.. the desired functionality is always to have the choice surely...? Even people that don't want this wouldn't argue that they don't want the option to change it...?

Sorry, I should have quoted what I was replying to. I agree with you, it definitely should be a feature to send as SMS to multiple recipients. I was addressing a few comments in here suggesting that MMS should not be used whatsoever for group messaging and that it was a programming error by Google engineers. 
 
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS HeresJonnie86 11/12/13 12:25 PM
+ 1
Just reported the same issue. Sending as SMS to group was in the Jelly Bean native app, why has it been removed now?
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Sammus187 11/12/13 12:29 PM
If this is google initiating some attempted to force people to do it their way, then they're no better than Apple. This decision can't have been an accident... Makes me worried that google will just turn into apple, before we know it all android and google services will be completely closed... It already sucks that they've canned replaceable batteries and external storage, one of the main things that set any electronics manufacturer apart from apple in the early days.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS ronsimpkins 11/13/13 12:38 AM
I have also had problems with Hangouts 2.0 converting group sms to mms. If the recipients in the group are using Hangouts they can see my reply. The recipients using sms only see a blank mms place holder which contains no image or reply message. It renders group messaging useless on hangouts. I have since installed GoSms to be my default until Google can fix this.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS foldupdrjj 11/13/13 12:55 AM
I just got charged £5 for sending out a group message. This needs to be changed asap
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS nishikant945 11/13/13 5:17 AM
Same with me. Google, please change this behavior asap... 
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Jeffrey McLain 11/13/13 8:47 AM
I have actually seen this exact same issue when replying to mms messages.
And again, another person here agreeing that mass sms choice is the way to go.  The whole group conversation thing has one use, whilst mass sms has another.  
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS DeanWray 11/13/13 10:05 PM
If you want to send images, files of any size, and your in the uk, maybe try my app ?  Built in the UK for the UK  :)  And cause I wanted not to have to pay MMS prices :)


Open beta at the moment, comments welcome  :)
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Peter Gregorc 11/14/13 2:43 AM
Sorry, but this really cant't be "working as intended". The auto conversion to MMS causes two big problems:

1) charges for MMS
Most carriers charge MMS messages differently than SMS messages. The later are cheaper or even free in most offers, the first are not.

2) privacy problems
When you receive a MMS, you also see all of the recipients. I can't be the only one that sometimes does not want the recipients to know there are others who got the same message?!

I do not want to use a third-party app for SMS just because Google decided to change the behaviour of a protocol that is considered normal for 15 years...
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS SteveLee79 11/14/13 8:46 AM
Glad I found this thread, thought I was going nuts!!
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS cambo81 11/17/13 2:01 AM
Yes, agree! This cannot be as they intended the app to work. I will have to use a third party sms app unless Google fixes this. Anyone from Google care to respond?
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS JonathanY. 11/17/13 10:50 AM
You're still phrasing your remarks under the assumption that 'most users' (which really reads like 'most users who matter') are Americans. They're not. Is it backwards that MMS warrants additional fees worldwide? Yes it is. But consider: many would say that paying for incoming minutes/texts is just as backwards, and that's been the norm in the states (at least it was a decade ago; I don't know about nowadays).

Whatever regional pricing policies may be, this is a very real problem for many many people (I don't know about 'most'; I haven't had a survey done). It does qualify as a bug, and the fact that unilaterally upending this functionality is unacceptable for you and many of your acquaintances doesn't negate that fact. Giving users a choice in this matter isn't some little feature Google should look at when they get the time--it's the only way to make this app usable for everyone I know, and everyone who has represented this point of view here.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS David Gawen 11/17/13 10:52 AM
Very well put!
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS David Gawen 11/17/13 10:54 AM
This is bizarre, are you sure it's hangouts that they are using to SMS?  I would have thought it would be the same version as now rolled out from Googleplay and native on the Nexus 5.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS fungusjm 11/17/13 3:39 PM
Same, very annoying. I actually quite like hangouts but not if i am going to get charged for mms! Will need to start looking at 3rd party sms apps if google aren't intending to fix this (nexus 5 user). Anyone word if there is any intention of sorting this?
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Sa Chu 11/17/13 4:02 PM
I wouldn't say it's "incorrectly" being converted into MMS - as it perfectly makes sense in the U.S sense, where most, if not all, plans include unlimited MMS by default.

Thank you Google for this change - as now I can finally group text with people in iOS - where the group MMS has been a default for a while...
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS schaubern 11/18/13 6:07 AM
I think there should be at least an option within hangout to enable/disable group MMS (and use SMS instead). Would be highly valuable for me and maybe people in the EU.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Peter Gregorc 11/18/13 6:12 AM
@sa chu: You had that option before - at least I had that on my good old HTC Desire... but you had a choice to autoconvert to MMS or not to do it. Now the freedom of choice is gone... and with it the privacy.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Iain McLaren 11/19/13 2:41 AM
I reported this too (thanks for the pointer to this thread).
 
Just adding my weight to the requirement for an SMS option for group messages. I'm glad I noticed the 'MMS' marker above the send button before I pressed it. My texts are free, but MMS's cost me a few pence each, which would soon add up. Seems like a simple enough thing to have as an option.
 
I'd also be interested to know if messages switch to MMS once they exceed a certain length, or if there is any plan to do this. I've drafted one that went into 10 parts, and SMS was still showing above send.
 
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS David Declercq 11/19/13 10:07 AM
Same here. Ridiculous! In Belgium it's near impossible to send MMS and it costs a lot of money. Please remove this automatic change. It is not necessary to send MMS until sound or pictures are added. So far very pleased with the nexus 5(apart from some minor issues) but this hangout app is very bad. Also if you can insert whatsapp and Facebook messenger functionality then hangouts is all I use. For now, back to handcent...
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS David Declercq 11/19/13 10:07 AM
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Raz a 11/21/13 3:31 AM
Exactly, what the hell are Google thinking. They probably  are getting a cut on a portion of contracts that are taken out with Google Phones which is why they are forcing us to use this irrelevant technology of MMS which costs a lot to send. use this app as a replacement - https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.handcent.nextsms  

It will work the same / better
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS fungusjm 11/21/13 7:35 AM
I'm currently using https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.textra&hl=en_GB, simple but works a treat.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS ivan loh 11/21/13 4:54 PM
Exactly the same  problem on nexus 5, non USA set. All other android phones i have used from Samsung, HTC, Motorola has group SMS function. It just doesn't cut it to have purely group MMS because 1) charges are high, 2) recipients may not be able to receive MMS.

Could Google look into updating hangout with the option for pure group SMS pls? Much appreciated

Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Colin Reusch 11/22/13 5:14 AM
I'm having the same problem on the Nexus 5 with T-Mobile. Any resolution coming?
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS JB1981-lob 11/24/13 12:27 AM
Dzeigman,

The functionality. Ie multiple SMS recipients is in the Jelly Bean stock messaging app. There is a switch in settings which can turn group messaging MMS off.

So I hardly think this is a licensing issue. Its just poor immplentation from Google and a very US centric attitude not realising outside of the US that we all her charged for MMS.

Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS GuB-42 11/24/13 2:14 PM
Not only it is a problem with carriers overcharging MMS but some old phones can't display MMS correctly. Also, where reception is poor, MMS often take much longer to arrive than SMS.
Windows phones have the same problem but at least, there is an option to disable this behavior.

Too bad, I started to like hangout SMS but it is a deal breaker for me.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS telemachus 11/25/13 4:23 AM
This is not correct. All GOOD SMS apps give the option of sending sms to as many recipients as you like.
Most of us have free or very cheap sms packages and MMS is extremely costly.

Of this was the INTENTION of the engineers, they should be sacked!

Regards,
Mark, Nexus 5.

Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS LDU 11/25/13 8:04 AM
Hi !

Nexus 5 in France, same problem.

Please fix: this is not acceptable to not have the choice.
The default behavior may be MMS for multiple recipients, but you have to open the door and let the user decide.

Laurent
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Dan Craven 11/25/13 9:28 AM
I've found a good interim solution to this in 8sms (Download from play store). It's built on the 4.3 stock messaging App so you can still send sms to multiple recipients without the garish interface of a lot of the other SMS apps. 

There is clearly no technical reason why group SMS on hangouts cannot be implemented seen as the option was present on 'Messaging' on Android 4.3, I cant imagine that it would be too hard to add the option back in and it is very disappointing that Google seem to be uninterested in doing this. 

Dn.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Opasyuk 11/27/13 3:25 AM
Indeed, previous sms application on  nexus phone (I have GNex) acted the same way and it was the problem as well. But sms app non Nexus phones like LG and Samsung behave as expected - sending seperate smses to every recipient.
One of the problem with that is that many users have their phones not set up to recive MMS. They simply do not use mobile sms. Thouse who do use internet disable it in rouming.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Paul Caheny 11/28/13 6:22 AM
This is a catastrophic issue with hangouts compared to other bugs - it's costing users money, not just annoying them with broken functionality! Surely this should be prioritised for this reason? Can we have some response from Google on how you plan to address this issue if at all?

If Google is promoting Hangouts as a replacement for the stock messaging app people should be aware it's impossible to send group SMS (only group MMS). When you add more than one recipient to an SMS in hangouts it automatically gets converted to an MMS - incurring huge out of contract charges on most networks around the world. Many people are going to be very angry when they see their bills this month and realise they've been sending group MMS when they thought they were sending group SMS. This means Hangouts is not a replacement for the stock messaging app - there's a huge functional regression by upgrading (the loss of the ability to send group SMS, i.e. one SMS to multiple recipients, which was available in the stock messaging app) , plus this isn't obvious to the user and is going to cost them a lot of money until they realise!
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Smiti 11/29/13 12:43 PM
Too much hassle - switched back to messaging.
None of my friends even use hangouts so there wasn't much incentive for me to switch in the first place, but this is actually a disincentive and is ridiculous. Even if this gets fixed I doubt I'll ever switch to hangouts again..bad move google.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Devidah 11/29/13 1:44 PM
Allright then. Until big G fixes this situation (since Google is going to fix it, right? :-) ), what is the best SMS alternative for KitKat?

Thanks!
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Raz a 11/29/13 2:04 PM
Google will only fix this major (and simple to fix error) if there is either

a) a class action law suit
b) if we all do a mass feedback complaint


What I have done is downloaded an app called Handcent SMS for free from the Play Store

I also then downloaded the iMessage iOS 7 skin for it so now it looks like iphones SMS app


Only one setting you need to change when you get Handcent SMS which is tell  it not to auto convert long messages to SMS

The app works great and has an excellent quick reply function so you can text people back with out opening the app

Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS fungusjm 11/29/13 2:06 PM
I use one called textra, very basic. But suits my texting needs
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS JonathanY. 11/29/13 2:49 PM
If I may suggest, anyone who agrees that mass-SMS (let's not call it group-SMS as not to antagonize Americans/others who really do wish to use group-MMS as the standard) is basic functionality this app cannot go without might do well to leave a low-star review on Play and mention the reason for their dissatisfaction. Google might not offer much in the way of support (as evident by their lack of response here), but they're sure to notice if one of their stock apps gets reviewed at 1-3 stars by a bunch of us.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Alessandro Luccaroni 11/30/13 7:29 AM
+1...this is a deal breaker "feature" (bug) in Europe. Hope that google will catch up soon on this one, as it is i will revert to other app to send my messages.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS LindieLoop 12/4/13 8:27 PM
This "feature" is so frustrating. I can't see how it would be difficult to have an option to send group SMS?  I have issues with internet on my phone, so even if I want to send MMS half the time they don't send, couple that with the cost of 50c/MMS it makes it not even worth using. I've moved to Handcent, and while not my favoured messaging app, it does allow me to send group SMS. Please fix this! 
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Neil Straton 12/5/13 7:16 AM
Totally agree, this is a must option for those who will be charged when using MMS.  Please give us the option!  Having to use a separate app for SMS because of this which is disappointing.

Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS David Declercq 12/5/13 8:33 AM
Just all send some e-mails to this adress. I'm sure they will fix it fast then.

android-ap...@google.com
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Quentin Vanwalleghem 12/6/13 5:23 AM
It is indeed very annoying and the minimum would be to offer the choice..
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Scott_Garrett 12/7/13 4:35 PM
I also just got a large bill for MMS, hangouts just went in the trash for me. 
hope Google will give us an option, if I hear it's fixed I might try hangouts a try again. 
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS NateHun 12/8/13 4:45 PM
I hope they add the group sms messaging feature in the next update!
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Treebeard101 12/8/13 9:27 PM
Yep, this lack of group sms is hopeless. Not only expensive, but some people I've sent mms to can't receive them either. Looks like hangouts is going in the bin until this is fixed.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Artem Russakovskii 12/9/13 12:03 PM
Guys, can you please confirm if Hangouts 2.0.2 fixes this issue?
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS MrPapaWago 12/9/13 12:16 PM
Haven't got 2.02 as yet, but let's hope so! Any chance of getting the apk posted to Android Police Artem?
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS David Hancocks 12/9/13 12:18 PM
I think it is.
It's on the release notes

Good work Google!

Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS JonathanY. 12/9/13 12:18 PM
@ArtemRussakovskii, it's unclear to me where the switch is to use SMS instead of MMS in 2.0.2
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Artem Russakovskii 12/9/13 12:27 PM
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Artem Russakovskii 12/9/13 12:33 PM
Well, as far as I understand it, you disable group messaging using MMS: http://i.imgur.com/ClwH9Oy.png, in which case it'll send out multiple SMS messages. I haven't looked into it, but from what I'm guessing, SMS doesn't support multiple recipients while MMS does, and now you can make sure MMS isn't used.


On Monday, December 9, 2013 12:18:51 PM UTC-8, JonathanY. wrote:
@ArtemRussakovskii, it's unclear to me where the switch is to use SMS instead of MMS in 2.0.2
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Iain McLaren 12/9/13 12:41 PM
I don't see that option, but I just sent a message to 3 people, and it defaulted to SMS. :)
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS JonathanY. 12/9/13 12:46 PM
@ArtemRussakovskii I'm still seeing the old menus. Play reports the version as 2.0.2, but in-app about reports build number 2.0.128. Did an uninstall and re-install just to make sure (with device reboot in between); no change.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS JB1981-lob 12/9/13 12:49 PM
Just tried 2.02

Disabling group MMS now enables group SMS. So its fixed. I still can't believe they forgot about it in the first place!

Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS JonathanY. 12/9/13 12:51 PM
@JB1981-lob please indicate what device you're using.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Scott_Garrett 12/9/13 12:56 PM
I have an N5, and Play reports the version as 2.0.2, but in-app about reports build number 2.0.128
no new menus for me
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS MrPapaWago 12/9/13 1:10 PM
That's weird, I installed the APK but don't see the option to send disable group MMS
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS WheatyBee 12/9/13 1:13 PM
I also have an N5 have updated to 2.0.2 and in app it reports 2.0.216 as the build version but I'm still not getting the group messaging option
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS shibbss31 12/9/13 1:25 PM
That's because not everyone will be able to download the new apk via the Play store immediately. Google always does stage rollouts. Even deleting the app and reinstalling form Play won't force the upgrade. Either side-load or be patient.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS JonathanY. 12/9/13 1:42 PM
@shibbss31, that reasonable, except that Play still reports v2.0.2. Also, being asked to verify the bug-fix, what do expect folks to do (i.e. how should they judge whether their result is relevant or not; surely you don't imply only answers to the affirmative qualify as a response to such a question)?
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Robin Werneskog 12/10/13 12:14 AM
Hi,

I can't find the option to switch between SMS/MMS. Hangout reports Build version 2.0.128 (914007-30).
Google Play doesn't indicate that a newer version is available.

Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Iain McLaren 12/10/13 2:15 AM
I can't see it either, but it appears to be the default option on my N4 with the 2.0.216 build of Hangouts, installed from Android Police.

In settings, I don't see the new options (as seen on Engadget http://www.engadget.com/2013/12/10/google-hangouts-app-mms-update/). I get:

Delete old messages
Delivery reports
Auto retrieve MMS (+roaming option)
Wireless alerts

I've not rebooted my phone since, so maybe that's why?

I'm just glad to have the multiple-recipient issue resolved. It was a pain to copy and paste the same text to several people :-)
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS takeshi_Hatch 12/12/13 3:04 PM
Agree with the original post. If Android cannot send a message to multiple people, maybe it can queue up the messages and send to multiple person separately.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS takeshi_Hatch 12/12/13 3:20 PM
I believe I have found a solution. Go the your Hangout or Messaging setting and scroll down till you see multimedia (MMS) messages and remove the tick where it says Group Messaging-Use MMS etc
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Iain McLaren 12/12/13 3:24 PM
Yes, that's the solution as implemented in the *new* version of Hangouts ;-)

For some reason though, on my N4, despite getting the official Play update and the KK 4.4.2 update, I still don't see the new SMS options.

However, the default behaviour is what I need, so I'm not too bothered.

Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Plattfuss 12/12/13 11:24 PM
This has been fixed with 4.4.2.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Kévin Tapp Minville 12/30/13 4:59 AM
I'm not using Hangouts, and my Samsung Crappy Note 2 started to do the same !

The problem is probably not with Hangout but with android 2.3 itself !

Fix this please ! It used to work !
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS warmasice 12/31/13 8:30 AM
This is silly. I have just been charged £12 from my balance sending happy new your sms's. I cannot believe Google suggest that's how it is supposed to work. I am not longer using the Hangouts app. I suggest other people do the same. Will Google refund me? No.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Hugene 1/4/14 12:34 PM
This is a major issue for me as well. Most people are not aware of this, and I have missed a few messages because of this and was unable to send a few messages also. 

Just had the phone for a few days on top of it.

Should be possible to decide if MMS or SMS is the way to go. Implementing this (to send a few consecutive SMS) is a joke (I am a software developer, I know).

No excuses, major fail by Google.

Installing a new SMS app now.

PS: There is no search in Hangouts! I liked the Nexus family because of the search. 
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Miguel Morgan 1/10/14 1:02 PM
Yes, using a Nexus 5 and the latest version of hangouts it has 'handily' (can you feel the sarcasm!?) converted a load of my wife's text messages to MMS and sent them as that. Luckily O2 are going to refund us, but this is a MAJOR bug in a default piece of software that is on Google's flagship phone (which is only shipped WITH this clearly faulty application)!

Please google, get this sorted now. Multiple messages should be still sent as sms NOT converted to mms. This is the sort of behaviour I'd expect from Microsoft, not from you.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Miguel Morgan 1/10/14 1:05 PM
warmasice, if you contact your phone operator, they may refund you.
I have just contacted O2, and they are refunding my wife's £8 of charges because of this very serious bug in hangouts. I will be phoning them again tomorrow, to pass on this thread to them, so perhaps some of the team can also put some pressure on google to fix this now.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Scott_Garrett 1/10/14 2:47 PM
It was fixed in 2.0.2
It is a setting now
Hangouts
Settings
SMS
Advanced
"Use MMS to send a single message when there are multiple recipients"

of course by the time it was fixed I decided 8sms was better either way (watch for the same setting there)
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Miguel Morgan 1/10/14 3:02 PM
Scott,

My wife has version 2.0.217, and I can't see such an option in the settings for hangouts (I'd already looked).
I have seen the option in 8SMS, and it has been (by default) set to NEVER convert sms to mms (see that google, someone has the sense to ensure that a setting that could charge people lots of money is DISabled by default!)
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS MrPapaWago 1/10/14 3:42 PM
Strange... my Nexus 4 is on 2.0.217 and although it doesn't have the setting described my Scott_Garret, it sends group texts via SMS, it only converts to MMS if I add a photo.. fine by me :-)

My wife's Nexus 5 is also on version 2.0.217 does have the setting, so unchecked the box and it's working good for her too.
Re: Hangouts SMS with multiple recipients incorrectly being converted to MMS Waqar Asif 1/31/14 7:12 PM
Same issue. I have tested hangout 2.0.217 on 4.4.2 and on 4.3. it does not work with any custom rom availalble. on 4.4.2 if you select default text message app to something else, it work for sometime but after Google Play Service updates it wont work. With 4.3 JB, messaging app works but hangout will simply wont work. Definitely there is a bug. 
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